The eBay rating system is no longer up to date and should be fundamentally reformed
Summary: techbro24 criticizes eBay's rating system, saying it has fundamental flaws, such as insufficient differentiation in negative ratings and sensitivity toward smaller sellers. It is suggested that the rating system be overhauled to make it more transparent and fairer, for example by introducing a genuine buyer trust profile and differentiated weighting of ratings. Other participants such as stubenkram and lidor3073 share similar views and highlight the need for eBay to better protect sellers. alena@ebay confirms that the suggestions have been passed on. Overall, there is consensus that reform is needed in order to meet the current conditions of online commerce.
I’ve been selling commercially on eBay for more than 20 years and I now see some fundamental contradictions in the rating system.
1. Buyers are practically always 100% positive
Sellers are only allowed to rate buyers positively. Neutral or negative isn’t possible.
So why does eBay show a percentage value as well as neutral and negative ratings on buyer profiles at all?
A buyer can repeatedly behave problematically toward sellers and still remain at 100% positive. That means this value is hardly meaningful.
Either this score should be removed for buyers, or replaced with a real buyer trust profile.
2. A negative seller rating says too little about the cause
A negative rating can have many reasons:
Package arrived late
Shipment lost
Buyer claims they never received anything
Response wasn’t fast enough for the buyer
Product problem
actual seller error
Today, practically everything ends up in the same negative rating score.
That’s too broad.
With a negative rating, the buyer should have to select a specific reason. After that, eBay should distinguish whether the problem was with the seller, the product, or, for example, the shipping provider.
Not every negative experience should count equally against the seller.
3. The percentage value is far too sensitive for smaller accounts
With only a few ratings, a single negative rating can push a seller from 100% to 95%, for example.
To buyers, 95% already looks bad, even though there may only be one unhappy customer behind it.
That distorts the seller’s actual quality.
A modern trust or quality value should therefore also take into account:
number of transactions
actual cause of the complaint
responsibility
long-term seller performance
The simple public percentage value is too crude for that.
4. The quota for rating changes is also illogical
Sellers only have a limited number of rating change requests.
If a buyer doesn’t respond at all within ten days, the request still gets used up.
So the seller loses part of their quota simply because the buyer does nothing.
An unanswered request should automatically be credited back after the deadline expires.
My suggestion to eBay:
reform or remove the buyer score
introduce a real buyer trust profile
distinguish negative ratings by cause
don’t automatically treat shipping problems as seller mistakes
weight ratings differently
replace the sensitive percentage value with a more robust quality score
credit unanswered change requests back to the quota
The rating system has hardly changed in principle for many years, while the entire online marketplace has developed massively.
In my view, it would be time to make this system more up to date and easier for both sides to understand.
roter_rauch
·3 weeks agoThose are already pretty smart & well-founded suggestions from @techbro24 . In my opinion.
And eBay’s rigid rating policy does bear fruit too, sometimes embarrassingly so. When I, privately, bought a small electronics item the other day, a part was missing. Nothing dramatic; it had already been missing from the sealed product/sales box, the shop re-sent it in no time, everything was fine.
But the communication about it – lots of apologies, emphasis on good service, on their own standards, on happy buying experiences & happy customers. I felt incredibly sorry for the shop, having to send out such marketing drivel out of fear of negative reviews. Which of course hit commercial sellers much harder than selling as a private hobby.
But that’s just by the way. I felt catapulted back into a master-and-servant era that I don’t like. And the shop owner certainly doesn’t either.
stubenkram
·3 weeks ago · EditedHello, @roter_rauch
That’s exactly what happened to me recently with my wind turbine seller. He had initiated a refund because the wind turbine hadn’t arrived at my place for so long. By now I suspect that the wind turbine actually got lost in transit and that he sent a second wind turbine to me. He absolutely refused to accept any money from me for it, wrote to me several times, and thanked me profusely for the review I left for him. It was a huge loss-making deal for him: twice the cost of the wind turbine and shipping, plus the time involved. I found that pretty creepy.
The idea that a seller could write a maybe not-so-great "selling experience" as a reply to the buyer under the review they received, as I suggested here, is of course nonsense for a shop operator like that. He would never do that. But for private sellers it might actually be an option.
The difficult thing is that there are so many different product categories and types of sellers on eBay, but more or less the same rating system applies to all of them. New and used goods are sought by very different buyers, who also behave very differently. Not everyone brings fairness, consideration, and understanding to sellers. Not to mention the crooks who abuse the system on eBay to harm sellers or buyers.
eBay has changed a lot and I find it very noticeable with "private sellers" that so little mutual feedback is left now, but maybe I just didn’t notice it before - or collectors rate more often than others.
I don't know....maybe the rating system should be completely anonymized? Only automatic ratings, which can be replaced by free text, and a hidden "star award" for buyers and sellers?
lidor3073
·3 weeks agoAnd I accepted a return too hastily and issued a return label because I was put under a lot of pressure (especially through the emotional angle, and for many reasons that really gets to me). I don't exactly enjoy selling things. But things are being blamed on me; once this is over, I'll write down the utterly absurd reasons under which a return is basically forced and a free shipping label is demanded. We're not on Amazon here.
roter_rauch
·3 weeks agoYes, @lidor3073 and @stubenkram , ratings are now often a real tool of pressure. That's uncool in both directions and light years away from the intended "shopping experience".
bootyooty
·3 weeks agoHey,
“When leaving a negative rating, the buyer should have to choose a specific reason. After that, eBay should distinguish whether the problem was with the seller, the product, or, for example, the shipping provider.
Not every negative experience should count equally against the seller.”
No, for heaven's sake 😱 eBay doesn’t pass judgment and can absolutely not check the seller, the product, and the shipping provider every single time; how do you imagine that working? 🤔
stubenkram
·3 weeks agoHello. @bootyooty
I think there's a misunderstanding here: Ebay is not supposed to "decide" that, but rather "distinguish" between them.
I could imagine checkboxes that have to be noticed and ticked by the buyer in the case of a red rating, for example something like:
shipped too late
insufficiently packaged
item is damaged
poor communication
hasjana
·3 weeks agoshipped too late could at least be checked using tracking numbers, and automatically too - if the seller met their processing time, that wouldn’t be a reason for a negative
stubenkram
·3 weeks ago · EditedYes, @hasjana but there are also items without tracking.
I hadn’t yet thought through which points would be necessary and useful in the list above. I just wanted to mention a few possible examples.
alena@ebay
·3 weeks agoHello @stubenkram I have forwarded your review for checking. You’ll receive a reply here within the next 48 hours.
Best wishes
stubenkram
·3 weeks agoThanks, @alena@ebay
I don’t know what the seller found "disrespectful" about my behavior, but apart from that, this revenge rating pretty clearly shows what the seller is like. Because of my reply there, she also has "plain language" in her ratings again. This reply would be gone if this rating were deleted.
stubenkram
·3 weeks ago · EditedHello, @alena@ebay
Have I been misunderstood here? I would very much like this positive rating with negative content to be removed. On 7/8, after I reported this to Ebay, I received a message saying that the matter was being reviewed. Since then, nothing has happened.
I didn’t really want to write anything else here about this transaction or this "green revenge rating," but now I guess I have to.
What the seller wrote to me in response to my first message, I don’t want to repeat here. It really upset me, especially the provocative tone. She only said she regretted that her packaging probably wasn’t quite as good as usual and therefore offered me a return. At that point, though, she still hadn’t received any pictures from me, and we may have been "talking past each other" because of the damage. In any case, she assumed the damage had only occurred during transport because of her packaging, although I had written something different about that.
In response to my answer that I wanted to keep the game, I gave the seller a week to respond, for example with an "okay." When I didn’t hear anything else from her, I sent the comparison pictures showing the damage. I wanted to show her that the damage to the game box must have been there before shipping. The seller did not comment on the pictures, but asked me not to send any more messages.
It is not okay for the seller to call me "disrespectful" in her rating and act as if the matter between us had already been clear. In her rating, she portrays me as if I had gotten rude with her or bombarded her with too many messages. That was not the case. In my view, I was still pretty factual, didn’t accuse the seller of anything, and also didn’t make any demands of her.
I wouldn’t have bought the game if I had been able to see the poor condition of the cardboard lid better, but the auction only showed part of an image. I should have asked for another picture before buying, but I was so busy counting the game pieces that I didn’t think of it. Because of the damage, the game is not suitable as a gift; I have since bought a second copy in a slightly newer edition. The financial loss is very limited, but I still feel cheated by the seller and, on top of that, slandered by this rating.
I also don’t feel protected as a buyer by Ebay if such a "revenge rating" is not removed. Opening a case would have been tied to a return. But since there is no picture here showing the condition of the game box before shipping, it would be my word against hers. The seller could claim that I caused part of the damage myself. But that was only one of the reasons why I didn’t want to send the game back.
By now I only buy very little on Ebay and almost only things like books or stuffed animals, which can hardly be damaged in transit even if they’re poorly packed. There’s hardly anything left here for my actual collecting area, and I was also tired of repeatedly receiving heavily damaged items or complete breakage because of improper or careless packaging.
I’ve only rarely written to a seller to complain about this, and I think I’ve given more than three or four gray ratings in 25 years on Ebay. I have never returned anything, but instead have mostly quietly accepted, sometimes massive, damage and financial losses. I often didn’t rate such transactions at all for that reason, because I didn’t want the extra hassle and didn’t want to risk a "revenge rating."
Now the thing is that Ebay gives automatic positive ratings if I don’t leave one, and if I get my money back for an item that doesn’t match the description, I may only get it back if I’m willing to send a damaged item that was badly packed back well packed. This (at least at first or ultimately?) at my own expense, because I can’t use those return labels without a printer or smartphone.
Am I really supposed to send back a pile of broken pieces (doll dishes)? Who does that help? Am I supposed to repack and send back a doll stove with what feels like 100 small individual parts that came with it, all unpacked, some of which may also have been lost during transport? Or a large doll kitchen where a loose pane of glass fell out and broke during shipping? This packaging effort is unreasonable and not "buyer protection."
Because of the automatic positive ratings for sellers, Ebay indirectly forces me to leave a rating if I had a problem. So in future, if an item has defects that weren’t described or if an item was partly or completely damaged in transit because of poor packaging, I’ll leave a positive rating that merely confirms receipt of the package. That rating will then be neither meaningful nor "relevant" - but at least I can avoid a "green revenge rating," won’t have any hassle, and won’t have any extra annoyance.
The rating for buying this game is the first red rating I’ve ever given anyone, and it came about also because of Ebay’s automatic ratings. It was my mistake to message the seller and criticize the condition of the game and her packaging. I briefly considered opening a return and sending the game back, but the packaging effort would have been too much for that too; I didn’t have a suitable box to hand. In addition, I had doubts about this seller whether she would really refund me.
But I only gave "the red one" because of the seller’s communication behavior. If the seller had responded to my first message, for example with "I’m sorry. Would you like to return the game?", then I would have said no and given her a positive rating - and without mentioning that the game was damaged.
I would also have been willing to change the red rating to a gray one, because after all the seller did offer me a return, even if she did so in a very brazen way. But she preferred to give me a "revenge rating."
I am once again asking that the message history be reviewed and that this rating that the seller gave me be removed.
lidor3073
·3 weeks agoWithout being able to write much right now: That would NOT have happened to you with me.
I’m incredibly sorry. 😔
stubenkram
·2 weeks ago · Edited@lidor3073 You should have described the game better and also shown the damage. And above all, you should have reacted completely differently to my first message. The seller really pushed all the buttons with me that drive me crazy. (Maybe it was the same the other way around.)
I consider it - purely theoretically - possible that the seller found the damage to the game box completely unimportant and that’s why it wasn’t shown in the auction. But I couldn’t clarify that with her. For her, the matter was settled with the offer of a return - for me it wasn’t. It’s just gone wrong.
I called Ebay today. The "green revenge feedback" that the seller had left for me was removed a little while ago - 10 days later.
I had already started to doubt whether the principle "no negative text in a positive rating" also still applies to ratings left for buyers - or only to sellers who mistakenly received the wrong rating text.
lidor3073
·2 weeks ago@stubenkram
Good things come to those who wait 🙏🤗
I’m happy for you.
And yes, you're right, I would definitely have photographed the game from every angle and marked it up (any one of us can miss something). But I would have clearly pointed out the damage - especially since it was older damage, as can be seen from the pictures - and would have priced the game accordingly. If a return had been possible, I definitely wouldn’t have reacted in an outrageous way either.
I'm really glad for you that eBay still “listened” to you. ❤️
Have a lovely evening!!!
over_dog
·3 weeks agoHello, a refinement of the rating system and a return to the originally mutual feedback, as well as attached limiting functions, have been a topic many times over the years! Unfortunately, when it comes to ratings and security, eBay seems to have hired the citizens of the city of Schilda!! In my eyes, what was created is a paper tiger, a stately appearance, but neither teeth nor instinct like the original!! Since on eBay you only learn from mistakes when the 45T looms, nothing will change either!!!
Regards
alena@ebay
·3 weeks agoHello @techbro24 We’re very happy about your suggestion.
We regularly take up suggestions for improvement and review ideas from our users. They are an important factor in deciding how the eBay marketplace continues to develop.
I have forwarded it accordingly.
Thanks for the tag @perfect-sally 😘
Best regards
lidor3073
·3 weeks agoThanks @alena@ebay
Please keep reading here too - @stubenkram has received a green revenge rating. According to eBay, that is not allowed. Thanks.
petersmodellbahnstuebchen
·3 weeks agoHey @lidor3073
@stubenkram should take care of that themselves. That’s not your or our concern.
lidor3073
·3 weeks agoHi @petersmodellbahnstuebchen
It was a topic here, though, and Alena maybe didn’t read it. In addition, @stubenkram had already contacted eBay, but didn’t get any response. That’s why I asked for help for her here again, since she has already given up. I think everyone deserves another chance.
stubenkram
·3 weeks ago · EditedYeah....let it be. As far as I'm concerned, the matter is settled. Unfortunately, I couldn't clear up this story with the seller. Thank you all very much for intervening. But this sale/this rating should not be discussed further here in the topic.
hasjana
·3 weeks agoI don't think point 2 is bad - the question would be whether all buyers would give the correct reason ... today it's already the case that the items are "defective" because the buyer doesn't want to pay for shipping when returning them
In any case, I've always seen the abolition of the ungreen BW for buyers as a mistake - and even if no corresponding BW is reintroduced, I would at least support a free-text field (without affecting the sacred buyer profile)
lidor3073
·3 weeks ago@hasjana good morning.
I see it exactly the same way as you do.
lidor3073
·3 weeks agoGood morning @techbro24
I see your post while scrolling and find it very interesting.
I’d like to explain the quoted text from a seller’s perspective: I received a neutral rating because of a delayed delivery ON SITE (I had shipped it on time). According to eBay’s policies, leaving a neutral/negative rating is not allowed if the seller shipped on time. eBay also removed this rating for me accordingly. Unfortunately, my quota for requests to CHANGE ratings has also been reduced by that one - I don’t think that’s fair.
In principle, I agree with you, the system needs to be revised.
@voli-maus
If a buyer has 5 red ratings - then I could consider whether they should buy from me or maybe rather from someone else - just like I look for a seller who has reasonable ratings. In my opinion, that should be possible.
stubenkram
·3 weeks ago · EditedHello everyone!
I’ve been on Ebay since 1999 or since 2001 (I can’t remember the exact year anymore). I was mostly always a buyer. About 11 years ago, I consequently stopped listing anything for sale on Ebay because I was absolutely not okay with the terms for private sellers back then. Those terms have changed somewhat since then. But I’m still not sure whether I should dare to sell something here again. As a seller, you’re in an extremely bad position on Ebay if you’re unlucky and end up with the wrong buyer.
I agree with that too. The current rating system lacks transparency a lot.
In many ways, I’d like to have "the old Ebay" back, back when listing and selling for private sellers still cost only a small amount, you could still find things here, there were exciting auctions, and buying and selling was really fun.
What I don’t want anymore, though, is the "blood-red slaughter" with revenge ratings for buyers. That was really unpleasant to look at back then and probably quite support-intensive for Ebay. (e.g. crying Ebay members on the phone). 😉
That may have been one of the reasons why, for about 20 (?) years now, buyers can only be rated positively. I also think that’s pointless, and maybe that’s why many sellers never rate their buyers, because they see no point in it.
I’d think some kind of automatic rating for buyers would be pretty good. This could even be done without any text. A plus point for every purchase that was paid for immediately. And the plus point would only remain if the purchase wasn’t reversed again, meaning there was no return and no case was opened.
If the seller feels the urge to tell their buyer that they really, really love them and would gladly sell them something again, then they could also write that as a comment under the rating they received from the buyer. But if they don’t receive a rating from the buyer, then that’s not possible. In this way, you might be able to encourage the lazy buyers to leave a rating more often.
As for ratings for sellers, I’m of the opinion that in certain cases it should be ruled out for the seller to receive a red rating. For example, if the seller refunds the buyer the purchase price and shipping costs. Then at most a grey rating should still be possible, or a red rating that has already been given should be (automatically) removed again.
I’d also find that very sensible.
lidor3073
·3 weeks agoHello @stubenkram
You’ve been active on eBay since 2006.
I also agree with your view on ratings.
I just read the dispute about the broken box the game came in.
Such behavior from a seller, who only creates AI texts and does not show/describe any defects or damage, is not trustworthy, and your red rating is appropriate. After all, it was AFTER contacting the seller, who had shown an unreasonable and mocking attitude.
Here’s the view from the app showing how long you’ve been here:
stubenkram
·3 weeks agoHello, @lidor3073
No...since 2006 I’ve been on eBay as "stubenkram". Before that I had another account for at least 5 years. I think back then I hadn’t even sold anything yet. But that was so long ago now, I don’t really know exactly anymore.
A stupid story, I had thought long and hard about how I should rate that.... but I really saw red. Of course I got a green "revenge rating" for it. I’d already been warned about that in a message.
lidor3073
·3 weeks ago@stubenkram
You can contest the „revenge rating“. No reviews may be submitted that are written as positive - that violates eBay’s principles and review guidelines. I looked at it, and this review is definitely worthy of deletion and disrespectful.
stubenkram
·3 weeks agoHello, @lidor3073 On 7/8, I asked for this positive rating with negative content to be removed, and I also pointed to the message history with this seller. But I haven't heard anything further about it from eBay. I think I'll just let the matter rest now.
That's exactly the kind of purchase I used to not at all rate. (Snippy seller, low purchase price, several minor damages that I can fix/repair) I wouldn't have kept getting annoyed about it, but would have just written the whole thing off.
But let's not keep talking about this story here. This topic is about something else.
lidor3073
·3 weeks ago@stubenkram
But it is legitimate that this review is removed.
@voli-maus and @perfect-sally please get an eBay MA involved. Thanks.
perfect-sally
·3 weeks ago@alena@ebay could you please take a look? Thanks
stubenkram
·3 weeks agoHello @techbro24 I had edited my post above already.
Can you explain that a bit more? What aspects should go into such a "genuine buyer trust profile"? How should it be created, through seller ratings or automatically by the Ebay system?
For example, Ebay excludes non-payers who have been reported multiple times from buying. The number of bid retractions is noted in a buyer profile. Do you mean such aspects or others?
I think that in some cases Ebay protects the seller far too little. A buyer who is determined to do so can take the seller's money and keep the goods (and, in addition, with false claims, still leave a negative rating to describe their "buying experience"). Such nasty tactics probably often follow the same pattern. They can also be recognized by similar cases that such a buyer opens. If such buyer behavior occurs repeatedly, Ebay should step in and permanently exclude these buyers. Instead, the seller is left with the damage and may even face restrictions from Ebay on top of that.
A seller cannot rate a buyer negatively, but they do have the option of writing a reply below a rating they received. Critical comments are also possible there, as long as such a comment stays factual. However, sellers almost only use this function when they are in a "defensive position" and comment on a neutral or red rating, i.e. explain their point of view or try to put something into perspective or correct it.
If a seller wants to let the buyer and the public know about a maybe not-so-great "buying experience," couldn't they write something there more often? It just doesn't work with the automatic ratings from Ebay.
The automatic ratings that Ebay gives for sales with tracking create a certain buffer here, so that the percentage can't drop quite so low if a seller with only a few "real positive ratings" gets a negative rating. On average, about 20% of the ratings received are likely to have been automatic. For newer sellers, it's sometimes even 40 or 50%. It seems to me that ratings are becoming less and less common. The same goes the other way around.
This is already done through the "most relevant ratings" among positive and negative ratings, although not in the way you mean. A portion of all received ratings is defined as "relevant" and shown to users first. Which ratings are considered especially relevant is AI-driven. As far as I can tell from the system, ratings are counted multiple times, so to speak, i.e. weighted more heavily, if they contain several keywords that fit the different aspects of a transaction.
voli-maus
·3 weeks agoWhat good are red ratings for buyers, @techbro24 .
You don't know who's buying from you.
If the buyer had 5 negatives and bought from you, what would you do then ?
hasjana
·3 weeks agowith auctions, you can often see before the purchase how the buyer ticks, and then react accordingly if necessary
the same naturally also applies to fixed prices, although these days it’s more complicated
... and even when I’ve described everything carefully and always packed super well and shipped right away, with buyers like that I used to always double- and triple-check everything and document it even more carefully, or pay for insured shipping out of my own pocket if uninsured shipping was chosen