am 16-05-2013 14:14
im not very good in german so i will write in english if its allowed here. What I want to speak about is how you can get easly tricked here in Ebay. Few days ago I've sold 0,5 BTC (its a kind of internet money - Bitcoin). Buyer paid 5 minutes later with PayPal. I've sent to him his 0,5 BTC and i thought that all is fine but sadly it wasnt. Next day i recieved an email from PayPal staff that the buyer didn't authorize this transaction (he said someone hacked his account). They have suspended my money (that i recived for selling BTC) and asked me for an explenation or any proofs that I have sent the item which I sold.
When you send Bitcoins to someone - you dont get any proof, bill or anything like that. You just send them to an account that buyer told you and its done - he should recieve it in less than 5 minutes. And so I did.
Whats also important - u cant get back Bitcoins that have already been sent!
Two days after the transaction PayPal returned the money to the buyer. I,ve lost both - money (62E) and BTC. My question is - where is the ,,VERKAUFERSCHUTZ" right now?!? I have more than 120 (positive only) comments. Buyer has SIX. Seems that my reliability and my comments mean less than zero in here. Not to mention that this day I've sold also 3x0,5 BTC and I recieved postive comments for it.
This is a massive security breach on Ebay. Right now I could buy 10 BTC , pay with PayPal and trick people for more than 1000E like this because PayPal would return the money back to me.
If anybody is willng to answer me - please write in english. If you have any questions - feel free to ask. Thanks for your time.
am 16-05-2013 14:18
Did you read the PayPal-terms?
am 16-05-2013 14:55
No - you are right i didnt read those terms. I called PayPal and they admit that they have no solution for this kind of frauds.
Im not going to cry here that I've lost 60 E - my goal is rather to block account of this fraud if its possible and to alert other users.
The only proof that I have is transaction reference number from Mt.Gox.com. Sadly i have no idea how can i check what this number gives me. Where can I put it so other people can see the adress in wchih my BTC has been sent - that could be a solution and a proof of sending i think.
am 16-05-2013 18:07
It's some sort of selfmade problems, virtual items are not covered by PayPal safety program either for seller nor buyers.
It is even forbidden do sell some kind of money and let the buyer pay with PayPal through the PayPal agbs.
To get the money back, the buyer cannot not easily report a undelivered item, he must make a fraud report at PayPal for his account. For safety measures, such reports are only possible a few times, before the account will be closed down...
am 04-12-2013 15:07
I have the same Problem at this moment.
But I don't think that this is a problem, if paypal is willing to keep cheater outside.
Every transaktion is locked in the eternal blockchain. That's why anyhow the bitcoin system works like it works.
And there are tools to investigate the blockchain like www.blockchain.info
With the blockchain there are tangible evidences about transactions in the bitcoin system and it's public for everyone.
I have a person who bought 2 times 0.01 bitcoin from me. after he send me his the money over paypal and his bitcoin address over ebay message system i send 2 times 0.01 bitcoin to him. then after the transaction has arrived at his address and was confirmed from some users of the network, less, than 30 minutes after i sent the btc, he said that the btc did not arrived to him and tried to get back his money over "käuferschutz" from paypal.
there are several clues, that his goal was nothing else than trick.
first: in his first message, he was not interesten in clear the situation, he immediately just wants back his money because he did not received the btc.
second: why did he after about 30 minutes know that the btc did not arrived to him? if they really not arrived, normally i wait a half day or a day and then i can say they did not arrive. but he knows after about 30 minutes that they not arrived and immediately tries to call his money back from paypal. so thats an clue for me, that he just want to trick.
next thing is. in a long conversation with him, he wasn't interrestet to cooperate and find a solution. I asked him several times if the address he transmittet to me was not his. but no reaction about ths question an I asket about 5 times or more, expressly.
The only thing, that he was frequently talking about was, that he got "Käuferschutz" because it's a digital article and he did not make the "agb", paypal maked it, he said.
Another thing is, he told me he also sold btc on ebay and accepted paypal the buyer also withdraw his money over paypal "Käuferschutz".
All these things are pretty clearly for me that his only goal is to trick.
Now I am waiting for a decision from paypal which should taken tomorrow.
But if paypal is not on my side, I think I take the judicial way because I can prove, that I did everything correct.
07-12-2013 07:49 - bearbeitet 07-12-2013 07:53
Leute Vorsicht beim Verkaufen von Bitcoin´s mit Paypal.
Die meisten die mit Paypal Bitcoins bezahlen sind zu 99 % Hacker die irgend welche Ebay und Paypal Accounts gehackt haben.
Und diese dann nutzen um ahnungslose Ebayverkäufer abzuzocken.
Also ich kann euch alle raten die Bitcoins verkaufen .
Akzeptiert KEIN PAYPAL .
Denn nur so könnt Ihr einen Betrug entgehen.
am 11-12-2013 06:51